The hosts say Simpson and Bruckheimer offered Val Kilmer a headlining role, which he declined and later regretted; the role was never specified. — Bill Simmons
Guesses for the Kilmer role are Viggo's part or Hunter, possibly turned down for not being big enough; he could have played every part except Hackman's. — Bill Simmons
Al Pacino was originally offered Captain Ramsey and would have dialed it up to 90 in his Vincent Hanna zone. — Bill Simmons
Warren Beatty was courted, another case of Beatty flirting with a part for a year before declining, as with the Burt Reynolds part in Boogie Nights, which is called the bigger miss; he would not have fit this movie. — Bill Simmons
Per a Don Simpson interview at Santa Anita, Pitt and Tom Cruise were considered for Denzel's part; Cruise was the first call for such parts for a decade, but it worked out perfectly. — Bill Simmons
De Niro wanting to play Vincent, with Pacino aged up, seems true; Coppola did think about it. — Bill Simmons
Sinatra for Altobello is carried into the what-ifs alongside the names mentioned for Vincent. — Bill Simmons
The actor who played Willie Cicci (transcribed "Joe Spinelli") was supposed to work for Zasa but died before the movie, so the character was written out. — Bill Simmons
Paramount approached Sly Stallone, Scorsese, Cimino and Warren Beatty over the years; in the early 80s Stallone was to write and direct with John Travolta, and there is an internet rumor that Eisner took a run at the script.
Waingro's escape; police releasing Kilmer at the checkpoint; Mann's L.A. geography and missing traffic; the public family dinner after the heist; the 'slick' clue
An early nit taken during the scene picks: how Waingro escapes with Neil standing over him with a gun, somehow rolling 50 yards away. — Bill Simmons
Kilmer asking pickup basketball players where to get bread was covered in the last pod. — Bill Simmons
Police let Kilmer go at the checkpoint instead of bringing him in to check, though they could get Vincent a helicopter for coffee. — Bill Simmons
Mann's L.A. ignores distances and has no traffic; 'two freeways right here' at the first robbery would mean sitting in traffic. — Bill Simmons
The crew goes to a fancy public dinner with their families right after the heist, and Neil sits there alone. — Bill Simmons
The crew is caught because a witness heard someone call the guard 'slick', which Vincent runs as an alias and confirms through Albert; it is called too convenient. — Bill Simmons
Michael Mann gets a yes from two voices ('I would go yes. Me too.'); the diner gets a yes; L.A. bank robbery movies get a yes. — Bill Simmons
Not Pacino overall, but over-the-top late-prime Pacino: everything from Sea of Love on is Apex Mountain, and he is better in Heat than in Scent of a Woman. — Bill Simmons
The late-prime run is listed as Glengarry, Scent of a Woman, Carlito's Way, Heat, City Hall, Donnie Brasco, Devil's Advocate, The Insider and Any Given Sunday, whose speech is also iconic. — Bill Simmons
Not Val Kilmer's Apex, which is placed earlier around Tombstone; by Dr. Moreau the wheels come off, but it all starts here. — Bill Simmons
The Eady actress is proposed as absolutely Apex (NYPD Blue then Heat, leading to Judging Amy) but is vetoed. — Bill Simmons
Character actor Voight: yes, as the start of his character-actor journey and a favorite Voight performance. — Bill Simmons
Tom Sizemore: Saving Private Ryan may be a more developed role, though Heat plus Ryan is a nice mid-90s run. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say Keanu Reeves was originally set to play Chris and lost the part when Kilmer fit it around Batman Forever; one host would totally go for Keanu. — Bill Simmons
The hosts say Ted Levine was offered Waingro and turned it down to avoid typecasting after Buffalo Bill; one host can't fathom it, the other thinks he would like that movie more. — Bill Simmons
The hosts say Voight initially turned down Nate, saying others could do it better, until Mann insisted. — Bill Simmons
An internet claim that the actress later in Mann's Miami Vice refused Justine unless the script was translated into Mandarin is called half-fast and fishy. — Bill Simmons
The Thief star lamented on a 1998 Thief DVD commentary with Mann that he had no role in Heat; the hosts say he should have played Nate. — Bill Simmons
Offered the Thief star as Nate plus Keanu as Chris, one host would rather keep Kilmer, whose unpredictable performance he loves. — Bill Simmons
Introduced as a new category with nominees: everything Voight is doing, Haysbert's Fu Manchu, Pacino's blow-dry look, De Niro's Van Dyke and Val Kilmer's bad-guy hair, a look only possible in the mid-90s. — Bill Simmons
Asked for a favorite, the answer is Voight's everything, with a joke that Voight's makeup artist should get the heat-check award. — Chris Ryan
A follow-up head-to-head between Voight's everything and Tom Noonan inexplicably in a wheelchair is answered with the wheelchair, though Noonan can walk; the hosts joke he lost the ability after inventing the internet. — Bill Simmons
Empty-telephone threat; "The action is the juice"; "The sun rises and sets with her"; Haysbert quitting the diner; tracking crooks without electronic surveillance; the walk-away-in-30-seconds philosophy; the music; Vincent Hanna's jewelry; Trejo's zip-up hoodie; Mann's L.A. locations
Neil's 'I'm talking to an empty telephone' is called the best phone threat in the history of cinema, with Van Zant's terrified look. — Chris Ryan
Also aged well: 'for me, the action is the juice', Kilmer's 'the sun rises and sets with her', Haysbert quitting the diner and beating up his boss, tracking crooks without electronic surveillance, the walk-away-in-30-seconds philosophy, Moby at the end and the music generally. — Bill Simmons
Vincent Hanna's jewelry: a wish to be a guy who wears gold chains and bracelets again. — Bill Simmons
A borderline nominee is Michael Mann, 'clearly an alien', whose gatherings are always big laughing dinner tables or dance parties. — Bill Simmons
Trejo wearing a zip-up hoodie with no shirt underneath. — Bill Simmons
The other host's pick is 'the action is the juice', loved more since the point about Sizemore going for it. — Chris Ryan
This version of L.A. and its locations, such as the taco stand next to the car wash on Pico, should have been on the list; East Coasters knew L.A. only from movies and it takes on new life after moving there. — Chris Ryan
One host tried to get creative with picks rather than the obvious ones; the other says this category requires playing the hits. — Bill Simmons
The first armored-car robbery: the truck hitting the armored car is one of the loudest, most terrifying sounds in a theater, and the shaped charge blowing out all the car windows at once is 'the coolest thing in the world'. — Bill Simmons
The robbery crew are clearly professionals until Waingro stares at the bleeding guard and kills him, forcing them to shoot everyone. — Bill Simmons
The Big Boys diner with Waingro ('I had to get it on, man. He was making a move'); a newly noticed detail is Michael moving to the counter while Trejo leaves to ready the plastic-lined trunk. — Chris Ryan
No customers react when Neil slams Waingro's head on the counter; De Niro is called vintage and purposeful in the scene. — Bill Simmons
Eady and Neil's first meeting ('Lady, why are you so interested in what I read or what I do?') is called their scene; it is believable because she is new and lonely in L.A. — Bill Simmons
In the meet-cute she lays out her Scotch-Irish Appalachian family tree and he answers only 'I'm from the Bay Area'. — Chris Ryan
Neil's crew debating the bank job ('The bank is worth the risk ... I need it, brother'); Sizemore heat-checks De Niro, like Reggie Miller against Michael Jordan, and lands 'for me, the action is the juice'. — Bill Simmons
Vincent realizing the crew has turned the surveillance around ('You know what they're looking at? ... Us ... We just got made'). — Bill Simmons
The diner scene between Neil and Vincent is introduced and called one of the most famous scenes of the 90s, or of the last 40 years, likened to LeBron and Kobe guarding each other in a Finals shown only in one-on-ones. — Bill Simmons
Square TVs showed one actor at a time, fueling a ten-year internet legend that the two were not in the scene together; widescreen disproved it. — Bill Simmons
Research cited says the scene was take 11 and was never rehearsed, at De Niro's request. — Bill Simmons
The exchange is compared to the two of them having a podcast; jokes about Vincent commandeering an LAPD helicopter just to get Neil to coffee. — Bill Simmons
De Niro listening and looking away before 'there's a flip side to that coin' is one of his favorite De Niro performances, though 'that's the discipline' is called his only bad acting moment. — Bill Simmons
Asked who wins the scene 25 years later, one host says Pacino and expects the other to say De Niro. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say Pacino later revealed his character was on cocaine throughout, a thread Mann cut from early scripts, which explains his darting eyes scanning the restaurant. — Chris Ryan
The other calls the scene a split decision, 115 to 114, possibly a draw. — Bill Simmons
The bank-robbery shootout is called probably the GOAT bank shootout that every later bank robbery homages; Den of Thieves is a flat-out rip-off and Inside Man the least like Heat. — Bill Simmons
Research cited says military units study how Kilmer and De Niro reload; Sizemore is rarely shown shooting; the hosts say Mann placed microphones to capture the gunfire live. — Bill Simmons
Shootout nits: the masked robber's 'we're not here for your money' reassurance, and Kilmer's slow 25-yard walk while Pacino drives in and gets out, which always drives one host nuts. — Bill Simmons
Neil killing Waingro and walking away from Eady is a tough breakup after she gave notice and packed to emigrate to New Zealand. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say production almost could not shoot at LAX because of a Unabomber threat. — Chris Ryan
Vincent versus Albert: Albert's salt-mine, pit-bull, hot-car-lot hideout and 'where's your empathy?'; Pacino is so off-menu the editing can't keep up, with audio from a different take. — Chris Ryan
Waingro's meeting with Van Zant: Van Zant has been living in his office, and 'I got some moves I can make here' is joked about as an NBA GM's trade pitch. — Chris Ryan
Vincent at BJs on Alvarado at 2 a.m., where everyone dances to silence because the music was dubbed in; Piven's Dr. Bob is also floated. — Chris Ryan
Stated answer: the most rewatchable scene is the diner scene, the second most is the bank shootout, and all other nominations are accepted. — Bill Simmons
The shooting range standoff; Pablo Schreiber's performance; Gerard Butler's performance; the cop names Borracho, Murph, Tony Z and Gus; the name Merriman; O'Shea Jackson's arrival; 50 Cent's performance; Pablo Schreiber's chin; the double-date dinner scene
The shooting range, where Merriman unleashes forty bullets in a row and Butler shoots back looking impressed, is their version of the Heat diner scene without any talking.
Schreiber carries his body like an ex-athlete and ex-military man; he was in The Wire season two and Emmy-nominated for Orange Is the New Black yet reads as three different people with the same face, his six-foot-five height may hold him back next to five-foot-eight stars, and the training from 13 Hours shows here.
If Vin Diesel never existed, the first backup pick for Dom Toretto would be Pablo Schreiber, who could do the backyard familia scenes The Rock cannot; four inches shorter he would be Henry Cavill, and he should be the bad guy who joins the gang in a later Fast and Furious.
Butler based the performance heavily on Gene Hackman in French Connection; it is unlike anything else in his career, and he is compared to Devin Booker, a talent who never quite became the top-tier lister the rom-coms sold him as, never getting a Gladiator or Beautiful Mind, though he has the Has Fallen franchise and this is his LA Confidential.
The cop names Borracho, Murph, Tony Z and Gus are great; Merriman is a great name because he is the worst hang of all time, and the host keeps thinking of the football player Sean Merriman.
O'Shea Jackson's arrival as someone who will be in movies for a long time has aged well.
50 Cent is very good at playing the one guy with the volume turned down, giving everything gravity, and never seems to mourn his wife and daughter before the highway shootout; the pushback is that Val Kilmer does more with the same quiet-partner role in Heat, and Ray Lewis or Ed Reed are imagined as stunt casting, while Idris Elba is too famous and flipping Mo McCray with 50 would be worse because of body types.
Pablo's chin is a neat trick: a street fighter either tucks the chin or puts it out daring you to hit it, and Merriman is the guy who always puts it out, which fits his all-in ending.
The double-date dinner scene unapologetically rips off Pacino taking his TV back in Heat and is ludicrous, with no clear motivation for Nick going there or for the wife dating so fast.
Mimi Leder and Janusz Kamiński were attached before Crowe’s interest brought Mann to the project; Spike Lee, Scorsese, and Spielberg were also approached. — Bill Simmons
Crowe would make a different but exciting Vincent, while Sandler would make the movie funnier but might prevent viewers from accepting Max. — Bill Simmons
