Nerve gas rockets, not nuclear, mark the peak moment for nerve gas; the film is said to have been a source of misinformation for British intelligence ahead of the Iraq invasion, and fear of nerve gas persists. — Mina Kimes
Alcatraz movies: The Rock is judged better than the slow Escape from Alcatraz, which was filmed during tours and was being shot during a 1980 family visit. — Bill Simmons
Naked guitar playing is absolutely Apex Mountain. — Bill Simmons
Movie mutinies go to Crimson Tide, with this and Mutiny on the Bounty possibly a Mount Rushmore. — Bill Simmons
Vanessa Marseille, after 90210 and dating Brian Austin Green, peaks as the lead female in an action movie; she gets it. — Bill Simmons
Christ poses go to The Last Temptation of Christ, then Platoon; needles in the heart stay with Pulp Fiction.
It is called the best action movie of 1996, better than Independence Day, Twister, Mission Impossible and Eraser, which all made more money; agreement follows. — Mina Kimes
With Armageddon raised as Bay's earnings peak, asked whether creatively this was the apex, the answer is "a hundred percent": the only Bay movie that rises to excellent, with Bad Boys 2 and the original Transformers merely okay. — Mina Kimes
Another view likes many Bay movies, even recent ones, but calls the Transformers films an anvil on his career. — Chris Ryan
There are arguably three movies (the military-government thriller, Connery's and Cage's), but by the Judd Nelson standard Ed Harris is in a completely different movie because he takes it so seriously. — Chris Ryan
Pushback that the core three were praised all along draws the reply that Harris is liked, just in a different movie, unlike Gene Hackman's quirks in Crimson Tide.
Counterpoint: an obvious villain would make a different film; the story rests on the bluff, which Connery reads ("he's a soldier, he's not a madman"). — Mina Kimes
The core three are rated more like Westbrook, Beale and Bertons, with a Chris Bosch comparison retracted, while Harris is called amazing. — Mina Kimes
The weapons-theft scene is praised: the "bubble face" guy trapped in the vault, the rockets with green balls inside, and David Morris's "sorry, dude"; a take follows that Bubbleface deserved to die for dropping the rocket. — Bill Simmons
Connery's first scene, 25 minutes in, with long hair in prison, is called one of the coolest entrances ever; the "lead left in your pencil" line and William Forsy's needlessly cutting insults are singled out. — Bill Simmons
The balcony escape (haircut on the balcony, lobster for the Secret Service, flipping John Spencer over the rail with a rope) is everything wanted in a rewatchable action scene: nine things wrong with it, but super fun; it shows a 66-year-old being underestimated, after the quarter cutting the interrogation window.
Any San Francisco movie with an out-of-control trolley going down the hills gets a defense of the car chase. — Bill Simmons
"Welcome to the Rock" follows Connery remembering the fire pattern; Bay himself pointed out the boiler would not still be working at Alcatraz, and remembering the sequence 30-plus years later is questioned. — Bill Simmons
The shower room shootout sets a record for slow-motion bullet deaths with arms-out convulsions; "I cannot give that order / you will give that order" is as good as it gets, and Michael Bean's commander scene is the first test of Hummel's morals, with Harris visibly upset.
The mine cart chase is the walkthrough's favorite: it feels like an abandoned Disney World or Pirates of the Caribbean ride, with a cart impenetrable to bullets like a protective bathtub.
Connery versus Harris is fun as two preeminent bald actors go head to head, though Connery wears a toupee; a Robert Duvall cameo is wished for. — Bill Simmons
Asked whether the mutiny shootout (with Tony Todd killed by a rocket) was Tarantino's one uncredited contribution, the reply is that after Reservoir Dogs everybody wanted every character pointing a gun at one another at the same time, perhaps with Tarantino suggesting a mutiny within the mutiny, as in John Wu and Tony Scott movies until about 2001. — Chris Ryan
The mutiny shows who is hardcore: Tony Todd (Candyman) signals he is not fooling around, Boeem Woodbine is softer, and David Morris delivers the ultimate betrayal; Harris should not have chosen new guys for the mission. — Mina Kimes
The green flares finale gets slow motion from many angles and green smoke; Bay flashes back to the Chekhov's flares rather than trusting viewers, it is unintentionally funny, Cage does another Christ pose, and it is guessed to be Bay's favorite part, with F-16s under the Golden Gate Bridge.
Favorite scene: the decontamination chamber where Stanley Goodspeed is first seen in action ("you want me to stick this into my heart?"), which sets a grittier tone for an R action movie. — Chris Ryan
Also rewatchable: the situation room call where Ed Harris calls in, with John Spencer, the White House Chief of Staff and Philip Baker Hall in the room; no movie has ever suffered from a situation room. — Chris Ryan
The situation room is felt to be a couple of that-guy types short (where was Robert Ridgely?); Harris announcing "Hummel from Alcatraz" and looking straight into the camera after the shower room scene are highlighted.
Favorite is the "Cistern scene" with a "Welcome to the Rock" attempt; second is the morgue scene, with the knife throw ("You must never hesitate"), the air conditioner kill, "that's just about the most awful thing I've ever seen," and the kicking feet. — Mina Kimes
A further most-rewatchable answer names the shower assault (SEALs versus Marines in the shower) and the mine cart chase; the answering voice is unresolved. — Bill Simmons
Billy Bob Thornton’s grounding authority, patriotism, product placement, supporting performances, commentary, Los Angeles doubling, and urgency-as-exposition
Thornton’s NASA director is compared favorably with his Friday Night Lights work and Ed Harris in Apollo 13; his “global killer” explanation makes outlandish science sound authoritative. — Bill Simmons
The brief asteroid discoverer naming it after his wife contributes an unexpectedly funny one-scene performance.
The film’s unapologetic patriotism still creates emotional force. — Bill Simmons
The Affleck/Tyler hill scene operates as an exceptionally conspicuous BMW commercial and marker of Bay’s early embrace of product placement against the era’s anti-selling-out culture.
Aerosmith underscoring Steven Tyler’s daughter during erotic animal-cracker play is preserved as deliberately noted psychosexual discomfort rather than ignored as romance. — Bill Simmons
Keith David’s skeptical military authority and the closing-credit wedding footage and memorial portraits are praised for giving the broad movie opposition and an emotional coda.
Affleck’s commentary challenge—why teach drillers to be astronauts instead of astronauts to drill—became a legendary critique, with Bay telling him to stop questioning it. — Bill Simmons
Will Patton’s reunion reactions, Liv Tyler’s durable career, and Bay using Los Angeles for distant cities are additional favorites.
The constant command that there is no time is identified as efficient exposition that keeps complicated space mechanics legible and the film moving. — Chris Ryan
What happens with Denzel's daughters; best Pennsylvania action movie; whether Rosario Dawson has had her apex role; what if the train restarted after the ending
What is going on with Denzel's daughters? They are working through college, delightfully happy and unexplored, worthy of a spin-off.
Best Pennsylvania action movie: this one over Striking Distance, a Bruce Willis Pittsburgh Coast Guard movie that might work better as a 10-episode Netflix show. — Bill Simmons
Asked whether anyone has fully unlocked Rosario Dawson, the answer is no: she has charm and audience connection but needs a movie built around her. — Quentin Tarantino
She is likened to NBA players who never found the right situation; she was great in Clerks II, and plays the Ed Harris Apollo 13 part here.
Death Proof is raised; she is one of the three heroes of its second half rather than the lead.
Ideas include a Kramer vs. Kramer or Silkwood-type role, versus a genre movie that makes her a movie star, such as a speculative book about a plot to poison Roosevelt that was given to her.
Late addition: what if the movie ended with the train starting again after the press conference? — Bill Simmons
Proposed replacing beloved Will Patton, fantastic here with the right amount of energy, with Ed Harris: the movie would not be better but different, and Ed Harris and Denzel Washington going nose to nose is a really good movie. — Shea Serrano
Will Patton is called the poor man's Ed Harris, loved in The Postman, and the others go with that answer as better than anything they had.
Original title Shoeless Joe, book working title Dreamfield, changed after test audiences; the voice's identity unknown, rumored Ed Harris; Damon and Affleck as Fenway extras; filming sped up for Costner's Revenge; the corn outgrew Costner; the Lansing and Ameskamp farms, 65,000 annual visitors, sold in 2011 for about $5.4 million; 1,500 volunteers' headlights in the final shot; Moonlight Graham's real game was June 1905; the line-drive reaction was genuine; James Earl Jones hates baseball; deleted scenes; George W. Bush's favorite film; AFI quote number 39; W.P. Kinsella bored on set; Ray Kinsella named for Salinger characters; Don Buford and USC coaches as advisers
Behind on time, the research is zipped through: the original title was Shoeless Joe, the book's working title Dreamfield, and test audiences thought Shoeless Joe was about a homeless person; nobody knows who the voice was, the rumor is Ed Harris, one host is in the Liotta camp, but Liotta hasn't even seen the movie.
Matt Damon and Ben Affleck were legendarily extras at Fenway; filming began in 88 and was sped up because Costner had to shoot Revenge; the corn grew taller than Costner so they put boxes out for him to stand on.
Scenes were shot on Don Lansing's property and the baseball scenes on neighbor Al Amiskamp (as transcribed), who replanted corn while Lansing kept the field as a tourist destination without charging admission, only souvenirs; 65,000 visitors a year by the 20th anniversary; sold in 2011 for a believed $5.4 million, so Don Lansing's checkbook won.
The final shot used 1,500 volunteers flashing high beams; the real Moonlight Graham played one game in June 1905, not 1922; Shoeless Joe and Ty Cobb really were friends; the line drive knocking over the bag of balls was real and unplanned, Costner's reaction genuine and in character; James Earl Jones hates baseball yet did this and The Sandlot; deleted scenes include Ray's hearing test, buying equipment, getting lost on the way to Fenway, and watching batting practice with Terrence.
George W. Bush named it his favorite film; if you build it, he will come was voted the number 39 movie quote by AFI; W.P. Kinsella was on set a lot and found it incredibly boring, though his daughter had a romance with Ray Liotta.
Ray Kinsella is not named for the author but for two Salinger characters, Richard Kinsella in Catcher in the Rye and a Ray Kinsella in a 1941 story; Don Buford, the Oriole and father of Damon, coached the actors, and USC coaches were brought in to advise.
Only three names are on the list, with Buscemi thrown on; Nick Cage is a yes by far, though whether this or The Rock is the peak of his career is debated, with Con Air having made over 200 million bucks.
Asked whether they like this or The Rock more: this one for sure, so much better because it is not as 'serious'. Two of the hosts have discussed before that Connery is not that good in The Rock, an old man running around Alcatraz in a Scottish accent, whereas Ed Harris is incredible in it; the premise fails because Harris was going to shut it down anyway and nobody would have died if they had called his bluff. The preference is for prison movies and big, beefy Cage, who was miscast as a chemical super freak nerd in The Rock.
This is the Nick Cage movie: after the Oscar and The Rock, Con Air announced a major star going for stardom, and it seemed he would be in our lives for the long haul, which proved wrong when about five years later it was over and he started making weird movies. Today's generation gets twisted up in superhero clothing or Iron Man's metal suit, so there is no 80s-and-90s style action star anymore.
On Cage the vote is yes from one host, with another said to be a no, and the yes is allowed; Trejo is a no, his career apex being Machete, or right now as a brand with his tacos and businesses, or when the show gave him his own category.
Malkovich is a no, his apex being Dangerous Liaisons; Buscemi is a no but can be in there; one of the great things about the movie is that it caught a lot of people not at their apex but all really good at what they were doing.
