Who is the 2019 Craig Kilbourne (as transcribed), the stunt-cast non-actor who would play the two-scene boyfriend Mark: a YouTube guy like Logan Paul is too young, so a sports broadcaster is sought, with Joe Buck, Gus Johnson, Jim Nance (as transcribed), Mark Jackson, Jeff Van Gundy and Trevor Noah floated before Jalen Rose is settled on, though he would never do it.
Could they have improved the Luke Wilson spot: definitely not Harrison Ford; Owen Wilson as the star is offered, and one host thinks Luke was born on third base here and others would have been wanted more, while another thinks the role requires only being smart and a little spaced out.
A favorite thing about the film is that in some scenes a character looks brutally hungover because the actor is, such as Vince Vaughn paying for breakfast in the diner looking like his night just ended and Luke Wilson's circles under his eyes; the 'Godfather' greetings in front of a nonplussed Ellen Pompeo are a good Fight Club joke.
Luke Wilson could be improved upon but would not be changed by one host, who loves 'Denver, the sunshine state, gorgeous'; the Harrison Ford take is called one of the worst ever heard on a podcast, and the hosts promise not to raise it on every episode.
Earlier, the fuller Luke Wilson conversation was deferred to this category.
The biggest flaw: why Ellen Pompeo's character would ever touch Luke Wilson's character, who spills a drink on her dress at the wedding after twenty years apart, is confronted on their date by a high-schooler in an Oakwood High jacket apologizing about her dad, breaks up her relationship with Mark, and has a kid to be stepfather to; the counterpoint is that she dated the scumbag Mark for two years, so her taste in men is terrible and she was barely fleshed out.
Why Vince Vaughn's character would not be a cheater: they had to zip that up so he stays within normal behavior, otherwise he is Satan; the scene where the girl kisses him and he pulls back is one of the best and weirdly well acted.
Craig Kilburn (as transcribed) is a no: not this, not SportsCenter where one host thought he was God, but his first season of The Daily Show; he probably regards this as his apex because he had the CBS late-night show and this part, which is more than a cameo, and the hosts like him and have had him on their podcasts.
Will Ferrell is a no: his apex has to come from his movie career, Anchorman, since his SNL apex was 2000 with Strategery as Bush.
Vince Vaughn is a yes for one host, not only his best but the revival that leads to Dodgeball and Wedding Crashers and gets him out from under The Cell; another goes Wedding Crashers a year later, when it was no longer a fluke, he was dating Jennifer Aniston and on the cover of Us Weekly, one of the biggest stars in the world for a year and a half.
Luke Wilson is a yes: this is his mainstream run with Legally Blonde 2 and Charlie's Angels, when he got the lead white-guy roles, and in a different era he would be in the Harrison Ford zone, which the others call blasphemous and a wild take; he is a comedy actor like Charles Grodin, not an action lead.
The Luke Wilson conversation: one host does not think he is very good, lucked into the right movies, benefited from his creative brother Owen and Wes Anderson, and keeps replicating the doe-eyed Bottle Rocket regular guy in Charlie's Angels, Legally Blonde and this; others love his persona now as a golf, bourbon and Cowboys sportsman you could meet on a semi-private course on a Thursday with a Tecate.
The defense of the take: they fucked up by not waiting to make Star Wars until Luke Wilson was around to play Han Solo, and had he stayed in game shape there was an action-movie path for him. — Chris Ryan
Elisha Cuthbert draws a no, 24 season 1, against the argument that 24 began around 2001 and this came a couple of years in, about as good as it got; whether Girl Next Door is her best performance is asked, and she is incredible on Happy Endings.
Patrick Crenshaw (as transcribed) is probably at his apex here, going out high.
A 2006 sequel script, Old School Dos (transcribed 'Dose'), by Scott Armstrong was turned down by Ferrell and Vaughn; Luke Wilson said in 2016 he would do it; Todd Phillips plays the man at the door; Ferrell streaked for real near a 24-hour gym and shot it in two parts; Patrick Cranshaw (transcribed 'Crenshaw') acted for fifty years, played the sheriff in the Air Bud films and died about four years later; the frat house is a real Pasadena house on Bushnell Avenue used in Back to the Future, Back to the Future 2 and Teen Wolf
In 2006 Scott Armstrong wrote a sequel, Old School Dose (as transcribed), about the aging fraternity going to spring break, turned down by Will Ferrell and Vince Vaughn; Ferrell's 2008 explanation was that it had funny set pieces but felt like repeating the fraternity setting; one host would still have seen it, another does not need it after The Hangover 2 and 3.
Of the era's comedies, Old School 2 is the sequel one host would most want; great comedy sequels are rare, Austin Powers aside, Caddyshack 2 was a tragedy, Wayne's World 2 is defended as genius after it came up with McKay, Anchorman 2 will have a life once off Epix, and both Anchorman films have hours of alternate footage.
Luke Wilson was ready in 2016, saying he would do it at the drop of a hat; Todd Phillips plays the man in the curly wig who knocks on Luke Wilson's door for the gangbang, a role he reprises in most of his films including The Hangover.
Will Ferrell ran naked for real, horrifying locals at a 24-hour gym; the streak was filmed in two parts, the second in front of everyone during the Snoop Dogg performance, and he needed to get a little drunk first.
Patrick Crenshaw (as transcribed), who played Blue, had acted in films for fifty years before this role made him famous, played the sheriff in all the Air Bud films, and died about four years after the film.
The fraternity house is a real residential house in Pasadena on Bushnell Avenue, obviously LA, used in three Michael J. Fox films; the hosts guess Doc Hollywood and The Secret of My Success before landing on Back to the Future, Back to the Future 2 and Teen Wolf, and joke about Redfinning it as more attainable than the Boogie Nights house, though it may be a two-block stretch rather than one house.
There is nothing to report: little information exists, the part was written for Vaughn, and despite the oral-history boom there is no Old School oral history because there was no drama, just everyone in the right place at the right time; a sequel script was written but Vince Vaughn and Will Ferrell did not want to do it, and it would have been a spring-break film.
Earlier: Scott Armstrong and Todd Phillips, the writing partners, wrote the part of Bernard (as transcribed) with Vince Vaughn in mind, a comeback for him seven years after Swingers.
Luke Wilson disrobing when frisked at the airport, about a year and a half after 9-11, was the first time anyone had fun with TSA, set to Ryan Adams's To Be Young, called one of the best songs of all time; Ellen Pompeo, about to become one of the most bankable TV stars of forty years, is a baby here with an under-written part; Perry Reeves looks the same as in Entourage and Kicking and Screaming and should have had a bigger career.
Earmuffs will probably win the category; the Dan Band swearing through the wedding song is great, especially the cut to Vince Vaughn with his hand up and the freeze-frame reactions of Will Ferrell and Perry Reeves when the first 'fucking' drops.
The Dan Band are in The Hangover and other Todd Phillips films, were LA legends who played bigger bars and Jimmy's show, a host's wife went to five or six shows, and Dan the leader co-wrote a song in the Netflix film Dumplin'.
Snoop Dogg is caught at a great moment with Cocaine and Warren G as DJ and Don Magic Wand (as transcribed) at his side, reportedly doing the music to get into Starsky and Hutch; a four-minute performance in the film is odd, and Melissa McCarthy's Life of the Party lifts the structure with a Christina Aguilera performance.
Craig Kilborn is fun to see, maybe the first person to appear in both aged best and aged worst: a memorable shitheel character in two scenes and the credits, yet he reads lines the way he read The Daily Show and cannot act next to professionals, which is presumably why he has not kept acting; as stunt casting it worked.
The closing credits have aged the best for one host: Kilborn crashes while smoking, goes over a bridge and kills a fly-fishing Jeremy Piven, two and a half minutes of credits story; Porky's and Cannonball Run bloopers are recalled, and The Hangover's Polaroid credits are called the best ever.
The soundtrack is a murderers' row of weird music: Papered Up, Paid in Full, Dust in the Wind, Hungry Like the Wolf, Gonna Make You Sweat, The Sound of Silence, Total Clips of the Heart (as transcribed), Lady, Metallica, and Here I Go Again played about four times.
This and Tenenbaums are called the alpha and omega of Luke Wilson, a good everyman for a while; the fuller Luke Wilson conversation is saved for unanswerable questions.
The film launched Will Ferrell, who has made one host laugh more than anyone since 2000; earmuffs is settled on as what aged best because people still say it as ordinary conversation rather than a movie line, like Kleenex.
A late addition: You're My Boy Blue, along with earmuffs, is in the lexicon and deserved a shout-out, as does the running bit of repeatedly calling some random guy Spanish; the clip of Blue is played.
Four opening nominations: Frank the Tank at Mitchapalooza through the streaking and the women driving slowly beside him; the green-hat oral-sex class; the dart-gun birthday party, including the bread maker re-gifted a third time; and Blue dying during the KY wrestling match, which may run into Blue's funeral and Will Ferrell singing.
Another nomination is the first meeting in the kitchen at Luke Wilson's new place, with earmuffs and Frank walking around with a hockey stick destroying things, watched eight times that week; everybody knows the guy who picks up the hockey stick mid-conversation and makes you afraid something will break.
The first scene with Jeremy Piven's character is very funny and a weirdly good Piven performance, subverting his PCU character now that he is old enough to be the dean; it is pre-Entourage and before he found the right toupee.
The opening with Juliette Lewis and two people in the bathroom, with Todd Phillips at the door, is nominated as a great twist on the familiar scene of a man coming home to noises in the bedroom; it is a good Luke Wilson scene too, and probably her best grown-up performance for one host, who otherwise fears her Natural Born Killers mode.
Asked for the most rewatchable, the pick is the hockey stick scene. — Chris Ryan
Another host goes with Frank the Tank coming back to life, from the guys pressing Frank to have a drink through the 'nice little Saturday' Home Depot speech to 'we're going streaking', and plays the clip; whether the scene runs into his wife finding him and the Speaker City speech is debated.
Other candidates: Vince Vaughn mouthing along to his own commercial, Will Ferrell talking about the car's restrictor plate, the wedding with 'it takes a real man to give away an angel' and the under-the-breath 'this is such a mistake, you got to run' muttering in the church that kills Will Ferrell, and drunk Luke Wilson meeting Ellen Pompeo with 'Denver, the sunshine state'; the hard thing with comedies is whether something is a moment or a scene.
The third host goes earmuffs along with Chris, calling it the most iconic thing in the film aside from the streaking and the most repeated line in his life; the hosts realize earmuffs came from this film, wonder whether it was a Vince Vaughn ad lib or something heard around LA, admit owing him royalties for Ringer-office use, and play the clip.
Affleck and Hauser were cast over Vince Vaughn, the runner-up for both parts: he lost to Affleck first and was going to get the Hauser part until Linklater worried he looked too much like Affleck and the two would be confused.
Renee Zellweger auditioned for Parker Posey's part and did not get it; Claire Danes did not get Sabrina because she looked too young, though she is a better actor than the woman who got the role; Ashley Judd did not get Jodie and two years later played Val Kilmer's wife in Heat.
The 'spot the sucker' opening line; the Billions DNA; the Mike McD face; the throwaway poker lingo; Damon and Norton at fun points of their careers; the look and the New York setting; Russians as villains; Teddy KGB's accent; the World Series of Poker ending
The first line, 'if you can't spot the sucker in your first half hour at the table then you are the sucker', may not be the greatest opening line in movie history but is one of the most memorable; the hosts want to see that list, which must exist on the internet, and float it as a vacation column.
There is Billions DNA in the film: watching Rounders is like watching Tracy McGrady on the Raptors, and the pop culture throwaways such as Buckner going into Shea became signatures of Billions, which also brought in Malkovich in season three.
The face Mike McD makes after losing the 30K is one of the best acting moments of Damon's career: the face everyone makes when destroyed in poker or blackjack, the life sinking out of your body; the sports-fan equivalent is the Marco Bellinelli corner three or the Case Keenum pass.
Having a big hand cracked while deluded with euphoria is called the most crushing unimportant thing that can happen in life; all the throwaway poker lines have aged beautifully and one host understands the lingo partly because of this movie.
Damon and Norton at fun points in their careers: Norton arrives with Primal Fiction (as transcribed), American History X, one of the most interesting performances of the last 25 years, then Rounders and Fight Club; 25th Hour mixes that guy with Worm; also Everyone Says I Love You, a terrible Woody Allen musical, and The People vs. Larry Flint, which has not aged well.
The Larry Flint writers, Larry Krasuski and Scott Alexander (as transcribed), also wrote the OJ Ryan Murphy show and Ed Wood and set the template for the clever, controversial biopic, like Man in the Moon, a style that now lives on TV in 13-episode runs.
The late-nineties talent cluster: in a fantasy draft Leo, Damon and Norton are the top three or in the top five, with Brad Pitt, Affleck gravitating to popcorn movies, feeder films like School Ties and Dazed and Confused, and Vince Vaughn; weirdly no black actors went to the stratosphere, Halle Berry aside.
Clooney, Matthew Perry twenty years ago, Wahlberg after Boogie Nights, Will Smith and Jim Carrey round out one of the best clusters, all 35 and under, compared with the Godfather generation around Brando; these people get credit as movie stars rather than actors, in the era when the Entertainment Weekly cover mattered and Carrey got $20 million a movie.
Norton took a left turn after the mid-nineties string: directing Keeping the Faith, which Juliette Littman likes, The Score with De Niro, Death to Smoochie, then 25th Hour, probably his best of the 2000s, and The Illusionist; he never had the Pacino or Gene Hackman career one host wanted, though he may still.
Worm is a character unique to Norton, out of the John Cazale 1970s: the lovable scumbag you root for without knowing why, with a little Fredo in him.
The movie looks surprisingly cool and undated for 1998 and is a good New York movie that still looks like the New York the hosts remember; the Chesterfield is based on a club called the Mayfair, and one host once played in a private room like it, the film's room being a slightly nicer red leather version of his, with that seedy but exciting feeling.
Russians as villains has aged the best: in 1998 the Cold War had ended eight years earlier and Russia was in free fall, but twenty years on Roman, Maurice, Teddy KGB and the underground network are far more believable villains.
Forgotten from aged best: Teddy KGB's accent, ridiculous in 1998 and loved in 2018 largely from familiarity; in the theater it was the movie's biggest flaw, a completely unnatural choice in a natural film, but twenty years later it works, is distinct, fun to imitate and almost a parody of bad Russian accents.
The ending of Mike McD heading to Vegas and the World Series of Poker makes far more sense now, since within five years that became the dream of basically everyone who played; it could have been aged best too.
Vaughn at the peak of his powers, a virtuoso performance including the constant eating, the breakfast plate and his immaculate bullshit, up there with Stripes and the great Bill Murray performances and Fletch and the great Chevy Chase performances.
There is little to add: lines like built for speed or comfort are really funny, he is great and agreed upon, the motorboating exchange is played, and with competition from Wilson and Ferrell this is called his apex mountain slash best movie, with kudos to Vince Vaughn.
Why not name Vince Vaughn's character Trent and make it a Swingers sequel? Is it acceptable for an actor to play a character with his own name? Should TV characters cross over into other shows?
Why not just name Vince's character Trent and make it a sequel to Swingers, since they never acknowledge they are borrowing the IP.
On actors playing characters with their own name, like Jack Nicholson playing a Jack, one host is all in and another finds it vexing, either the actor not wanting to think of another name or everyone deciding Jack fits, noting Chinatown moved to Jake.
On extending a character into another vehicle, one host is fine with it and recalls Coolidge from The White Shadow becoming the janitor on St. Elsewhere, made by Gwyneth Paltrow's dad, and an episode where the actor who played Salami appears as a different character; the later version is Richard Belzer's Munch moving from Homicide to Law & Order; Boghossian (as transcribed) being the same guy in Billions and Succession would have shattered it.
The daytime wedding, boat ride and football game all on the same day; the family inviting two strangers to an intimate gathering with no vetting or Secret Service; the best man showing up late to the wedding; Rachel McAdams's character dating the obviously awful Sack
Timeline: the first rich-family wedding is during the day, then they take a boat to the house and play football the same day, which has always bothered one host because the crashers' rules are built for accelerating at night; listeners are asked to email the mailbag with the time continuity.
Randomly inviting two dudes to a pretty intimate family gathering without more questions is weird; a government official, the Secretary of the Treasury, would run their names and have a Secret Service person, and the hosts picture Steve Mnuchin in the Walken role.
One host hates nitpicking dumb comedies but has problems with the best man showing up late to the wedding, Owen Wilson being Vince Vaughn's only best man; the biggest movie bullshit is why Rachel McAdams' character is dating Sack, so obviously a prick that it is not credible, though it is tough to nitpick a comedy.
