Carpenter's psychiatric-hospital inspiration; the fear meter; The Babysitter Murders script; California locations; Carpenter's $10,000 fee; character-name origins; the station wagon's fate; the Orange Grove Avenue houses
The hosts report that Carpenter toured a psychiatric hospital in college and met a child who stared at him with "a look of evil," the source of the blackest-eyes idea. — Chris Ryan
The hosts report the film was shot out of sequence in 20 days, so Carpenter created a fear meter for Jamie Lee. — Chris Ryan
The hosts report the original script, The Babysitter Murders, took place over several days and became one day for budget reasons. — Chris Ryan
The hosts point to Southern California shooting visible in palm trees, California plates, and a hardware store on Genesee. — Chris Ryan
The hosts report that the producer heard as "Yoblins" and Akkad paid Carpenter $10,000 to write, direct and score, that the same producer suggested Halloween, that Carpenter pictured an old haunted-house film, and that the script took 10 days. — Chris Ryan
Name origins as the hosts give them: Haddonfield from Hill's New Jersey hometown, Bowling Green street names, Laurie Strode an old girlfriend, Michael Myers a producer, Tommy Doyle a Rear Window homage, Sam Loomis a Psycho homage, and Brackett after a screenwriter. — Chris Ryan
The hosts report the 1978 Ford LTD station wagon was rented from the Illinois government, auctioned in 1981, left in a barn for 37 years and restored; the host wants it and guesses $95,000 to $100,000. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say the two homes are on Orange Grove Avenue, chosen for few palm trees, between Sunset and Franklin. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say Pleasence was the third choice and that Peter Cushing and Christopher Lee both turned it down because the pay was too low; Lee, remembered as Dracula, would have been weird casting. — Bill Simmons
Cushing was coming off Star Wars; Star Wars and Halloween back to back would have been iconic. — Bill Simmons
The hosts describe Pleasence as having peaked as a Bond guy and being in The Great Escape, and say he hosted Saturday Night Live in 1981, is considered one of the weirdest hosts, and kept going through the sequels. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say Carpenter wanted Anne Lockhart, daughter of June Lockhart from Lassie, but she was in other stuff, so they went with Jamie Lee, whose mom was in Psycho. — Chris Ryan
The hosts say Dennis Quaid, then dating P. J. Soles, was supposed to be Bob but was doing another movie, and tell a screening story in which Quaid offers to fight a heckler. — Chris Ryan
A six-year-old killing his older sister still bothers the speaker, who thinks his own daughter could fend one off even sitting down. — Bill Simmons
Casting Jamie Lee as the daughter of a Psycho star was a big deal in 1978, when Psycho had only been out 15 years, but no longer matters. — Bill Simmons
Myers still struggles with the killing, with the raw tools there but not yet formed, compared to a young basketball player. — Chris Ryan
The sexual-subtext reading, as a host lays it out: the virgin survives while flirting with the killer, sings "I wish I had you all alone," and keeps leaving phallic objects (knitting needle, knife, wire hanger) near Myers; the host quotes Carpenter on her repressed energy. — Chris Ryan
The reading is doubted as more thought than the filmmakers put in; Carpenter is said to have "whistled a couple of different tunes," earlier saying she lived because she was least distracted. — Chris Ryan
The disturbing, effective trigger is that his sister is having sex, with Laurie as her proxy. — Chris Ryan
Halloween 2 and H2O make Laurie his sister, which muddles the subtext; franchises of that era were retrofitted with "spit and dental floss." — Chris Ryan
Horror conditioned audiences to expect couples who walk off to have sex to die, through the nineties and maybe the 2000s; with 20 days and three babysitters, the filmmakers likely did not overthink it. — Bill Simmons
Most sequels: keep Halloween 1, a flawed Halloween 2 with some of Loomis's best stuff, H2O and the 2018 film; Halloween 4 is enjoyed, and Season of the Witch has defenders the host resists. — Bill Simmons
The other host has no further aged-worst picks; everything else is nitpicks. — Chris Ryan
Original Myers mask; Myers head tilts; lack of gore; the title; opening credits and music; Myers stalking Haddonfield all day; the driving exchange; the opening single take; nobody believing kids; neighbors shutting their lights; Bob's seventies van; the "blackest eyes" line; horny Myers; Kyle Richards as Lindsey; Sports Century Michael Myers column; Carpenter's filmmaking
The original mask is the best they ever did; the hosts recount that it was a Captain Kirk mask bought for two bucks on Hollywood Boulevard, eyeholes widened and spray-painted bluish white by Tommy Wallace, that Hill and Carpenter wanted him faceless and non-human, and that he becomes known as the Shape. — Chris Ryan
The hosts recount that a smiling clown mask with frizzy red hair was also tested but felt too weird, so they went with the Shatner mask. — Chris Ryan
The original mask was thrown out and never recreated, a big gripe of the host's buddy Jeff about the sequels; necessity was the mother of invention, including reusing leaves. — Chris Ryan
The head tilts, the smart lack of gore, and calling it Halloween rather than Halloween Massacre, The Shape or Michael Myers. — Chris Ryan
The opening credits with the pumpkin and the music, including the variations for Myers in motion versus Laurie crossing the street and the scare cue, with a Jaws comparison. — Chris Ryan
Michael stalking Haddonfield all day, though the girls should notice the same station wagon tailgating them. — Chris Ryan
The "For God's sake, Sam, he doesn't even know how to drive a car" exchange acknowledges how ridiculous his driving is. — Chris Ryan
The opening single take on a new camera, the "panel glide" as heard, is inventive, if maybe not a top-three single take. — Chris Ryan
The horror concept of nobody believing little kids, and the neighbors turning off their lights and closing their shades when Laurie comes to the door. — Chris Ryan
Bob's seventies van is added as an aged-best pick. — Bill Simmons
The "blank, pale, emotionless face, the blackest eyes, the devil's eyes" line; seeing little Michael makes the Shape scarier. — Bill Simmons
A host says deleted TV scenes on YouTube include Loomis before the medical board and "You fooled them all, Michael." — Chris Ryan
Horny Myers, watching hookups and the girl in the laundry room, "basically going through puberty in the movie." — Chris Ryan
A host notes that Lindsey was played by future Real Housewives of Beverly Hills star Kyle Richards, who is in the new Halloween. — Chris Ryan
A personal pick: the speaker's own 2002 ESPN column written as a Sports Century episode about Michael Myers, satirizing media people and getting past Walsh's satire rule. — Chris Ryan
Carpenter's full filmmaking contribution: co-writing with Hill, directing and composing a score done in five days on a Casio, like Coppola also doing the Godfather music. — Chris Ryan
Russell reportedly stayed in character but removed the eye patch between takes because it damaged his depth perception. — Bill Simmons
East St. Louis was selected for its old buildings, river, bridge, and blocks of fire-damaged rubble. — Bill Simmons
The Chain of Rocks Bridge was reportedly purchased for one dollar, and the city darkened ten blocks nightly for filming. — Bill Simmons
An eleven-year-old J. J. Abrams reportedly prompted the insert proving Maggie died, which Carpenter shot with Adrian Barbeau in their garage. — Bill Simmons
James Cameron worked on visual effects and cinematography before The Terminator and was considered the set genius. — Bill Simmons
The performer whose name is transcribed as Season Hubbly was married to Kurt Russell, which is offered as the reason she joined the cast. — Bill Simmons
The producers doubted Close’s sexual suitability until her hair and chemistry with Douglas helped establish the role. — Bill Simmons
Stone auditioned and was passed over; the panel argues Alex should be Douglas’s contemporary. Field, Alley and Thompson are reported as considered, with uncertainty. — Bill Simmons
Elisabeth Shue’s candidacy is doubted because of her age; Carrie Fisher is mentioned, and Field’s ability to play Alex is debated through Sybil.
Reeve reportedly declined Dan; the panel doubts his fit for spontaneous moral compromise. MacDowell was considered for Beth. — Wesley Morris
MacDowell is described as a later market replacement for Archer, with hypothetical Archer roles in Sex, Lies, and Videotape, Groundhog Day and Short Cuts.
De Palma reportedly wanted Douglas replaced; Carpenter then declined over similarities to Play Misty for Me and objections to the original ending. — Wesley Morris
Hanks took percentage points instead of a salary and made over $40 million; Jim Hanks doubled in the running scenes; Eric Roth's 2001 sequel script from Gump and Company was dropped after 9/11; what Forrest says when the rally microphone cuts out; Jenny's tombstone birthday is the day of the Trinity test; the run was inspired by Louis Michael Figueroa's 1982 run; the Savannah bench went to the Smithsonian; Bubba Gump has 33 locations; Kurt Russell voiced Elvis; Warner Brothers traded the rights for Executive Decision; a cut scene of Forrest distracting dogs attacking Martin Luther King; Jenny's gift shoes were 1974 Nike Cortez; six Doors songs
Tom Hanks was not paid for the film but took percentage points and made over 40 million dollars; the film is based on the 1986 novel; Hanks's younger brother Jim Hanks doubled for him in the running scenes, and nobody has heard of Jim Hanks, prompting a joke about parents giving every son a three-letter name.
Eric Roth wrote a sequel screenplay in 2001 based on Winston Groom's follow-up novel Gump and Company, opening with Forrest on a bench waiting for his son to return from school; after the September 11 attacks, Roth, Zemeckis and Hanks decided the story was no longer relevant. The hosts are glad there is no extended universe and agree a Forrest Gump 2 would have been a big mistake.
When the microphone cuts out at the Vietnam rally, the lost lines are that sometimes people who go to Vietnam go home to their mamas without any legs, sometimes they don't go home at all, that's a bad thing, and that's all there is to say about that.
Jenny's birthday on her tombstone, July 16, 1945, is the same day as the Trinity test, the first atomic bomb detonation; whether it was purposeful is left uncertain, someone is working hard on connections, and joke that Jenny was the atomic bomb of Forrest's life.
The running was inspired by a real event: in 1982 Louis Michael Figueroa, aged sixteen, ran from New Jersey to San Francisco for the American Cancer Society, somehow stretched into three and a half years. The park bench was in Savannah's Chippewa Square and was sent to the Smithsonian; Bubba Gump now has 33 locations including the Santa Monica pier, where one host has never eaten and the other says he is not missing much; Kurt Russell voiced Elvis and famously played Elvis in a John Carpenter movie, and Val Kilmer was the Elvis in True Romance.
In 1988 Warner Brothers gave up the rights to the film in exchange for the rights to Executive Decision, released in 1996, because the studio felt the project had lost commercial promise after Rain Man; the hosts call it the Harden trade for movies and joke that Steven Adams was thrown in.
A planned effects shot had Forrest running into Martin Luther King and his supporters and distracting the dogs attacking them by playing fetch; cutting it was a strong edit that probably saved the movie. The hosts also note that Forrest is literally a descendant of the Ku Klux Klan, with the sheet-pulling scene, which would not make a 2018 version, and agree nobody wants Woke Gump.
The shoes Jenny gives Forrest were Nike's 1974 Cortez running shoes.
Is wearing replicas of the Cortez shoes right now. — Bill Simmons
The six Doors songs are Soul Kitchen, Hello I Love You, People Are Strange, Break On Through, Peace Frog and Love Her Madly; Soul Kitchen is liked but the use is obvious, especially in Vietnam. One host is accused of destroying Zemeckis for obvious musical taste while giving Scorsese a pass for Gimme Shelter in seven movies; the reply is that Scorsese's reuse of the same nine Stones songs is annoying but not literal, whereas the songs chosen by Zemeckis are literally about the feeling being conveyed.
Wes Craven could be argued but Elm Street is still his Apex Mountain; his amazing career spans the three stages of late-century horror, from Hills Have Eyes and Last House on the Left to creating Freddy and reinventing the genre in the nineties, and he is underrated, on a Mount Rushmore with Tobey Hooper (as transcribed), George Romero and John Carpenter; the movie still moves today.
The coming Halloween remake with Jamie Lee Curtis is asking audiences to forget some sequels, like Rocky Balboa waving off Rocky V, which is what 48 Hours should have done.
A confession that Nightmare on Elm Street was a shitty movie meets a fan of the first two and Dream Warriors; Heather Langenkamp is dismissed, and Wes Craven's New Nightmare, the meta Freddy movie, failed just before this, leaving Scream as a bit of a last gasp for his career.
Neve Campbell's nominees are this or the intervention scene with Bailey in Party of Five.
Another feels the same way about the intervention, called the saddest hour in television history with Bailey as the rock of the family, and it stands even against Scream's $290 million.
Skeet Ulrich is clearly at his Apex, with nothing else competing; he was in As Good as It Gets, went a couple of rounds with Jericho, and is now known to kids as Riverdale's Skeet Ulrich.
A tangent on Skeet Ulrich's first name becoming slang, popularized by Dave Chappelle, and whether his stage name was a bad choice slides into a crude callback to the Silence of the Lambs episode's Migs discussion.
Reader Howard from Calgary writes that Stuart Rudin, who played Migs, was in Sticky Fingers and has an IMDb of homeless men, winos and patients; Migs was his Apex Mountain, and listeners are invited to the mailbag.
Matthew Lillard: it has got to be, with SLC Punk raised; considering how good he is in Scream, this is his Apex.
Jamie Kennedy was forced on the culture with an MTV show after this and never took; his Apex Mountain is definitively dating Jennifer Love Hewitt, an achievement rather than a performance, which leads to a tangent on why women disliked her.
For David Arquette the reminder is that he held the WCW heavyweight title, a movie tie-in, the belt once held by Ric Flair.
Eight Legged Freaks is also raised for Arquette; Rose McGowan is a no, her later weirdness and dating Marilyn Manson jokingly called her apex, though she had a cool indie career, the Rodriguez Grindhouse movie with the gun leg, and is now a filmmaker and activist.
Courtney Cox is first a no, since it has got to be Friends and you cannot get higher; one voice later counters, unresolved, that the combination is her apex, since this came out during Friends season three when Monica was dismissed as having no personality and showed she could be the bitch too; her later characters are more Gail Weathers than Monica.
She reportedly pursued the role to play someone not traditionally nice and to get punched in the face; her later sitcoms were Dirt and the Bill Lawrence show about people in LA drinking wine, whose title nobody can remember.
Henry Winkler is joked to have been the mountain itself.
Earlier, while praising the cast, Drew Barrymore is followed by the garbled phrase 'I'd heard, like, Mad Love Apex' (as transcribed).
