Which gangs were not invited? Would a coded gang radio station have worked in 1979? How long did Swan and Mercy stay together? What happened to Ajax? Did the Riffs kill Luther?
Which gangs were too weak to be invited was already covered; whether a DJ communicating in code to gangs would have worked in 1979 or whether the police would have simply listened is asked, with the defense that it is underground and nobody talks.
The DJ is the most clever part of the movie for solving how to reach everyone at once, and the shot of Lynn Thinkpen's (as transcribed) mouth against pink-red light dropping the needle is slick.
How long Swan and Mercy stayed together: maybe a week, tops, since Coney is far, and he needed to see her after a shower.
Ajax is probably dead within three years, going to jail and then shot in an armed robbery; the alternative where he grows up to be the rich guy from Sex and the City is enjoyed.
Later, whether the Riffs killed Luther at the end is called an unanswerable question; one host thinks they killed him slowly over many days in that dark cement parking garage compound.
Rushed to beat The Wanderers; Fox was meant to end up with Mercy; the Dingoes subplot was cut after Beck and Van Bakkenberg's chemistry showed; the Rogues drove a 1955 Cadillac hearse; Michael Beck became born again; Sunny Landon was hit by the bat; Mercy's stitches and broken wrist; production paid off gangs via an NYPD contact
The movie was rushed to get ahead of another gang movie, The Wanderers, by Philip Kaufman of The Right Stuff, with Ken Wall (as transcribed) of Wise Guy; two hosts have never seen it, prompting a joke about being only 26.
Fox was originally to end up with Mercy; in the book and original script Swan was captured by a gay gang called the Dingoes, who had Dobermans, and escaped later, but Walter Hill saw the dailies, noticed Beck and Van Bakkenberg (as transcribed) had chemistry, and rewrote everything to drop the Dingoes; Dobermans are compared to Halle Berry's dogs in John Wick 3.
The Rogues drove a 1955 Cadillac hearse; Michael Beck partied too much during filming and became born again; Sunny Landon (as transcribed), later in Predator, was the cop Swan hits with the bat, and in one take Mercy was hit in the face and needed stitches.
Mercy broke her wrist running with the stunt double, which is why she wears the jacket for the rest of the movie, explaining the odd 'where'd you get that jacket' exchange; to film anywhere in the five boroughs production paid off whoever ran that turf, with an NYPD contact telling Marshall the producer which gang members needed paying.
Ajax's language and sexual assault (disputed); what is said to Mercy; Cleon's death; Fox's stunt double being thrown onto the tracks and never mentioned again
Ajax is simultaneously a great character and badly aged for his language and being a sexual assaulter.
The counterargument is that a movie about gangs who stalk the streets needs a bad guy, and Ajax contrasts with Swan's King Arthur moral code; a bad guy in a 1979 New York gang is plausible, though some of his words are hard to hear now, and what is said to Mercy is not great.
Cleon dying has aged terribly and hurts every time; the stunt double thrown onto the tracks and the character never being mentioned again is one host's vote.
The story recited: Michael Beck as Swan and Thomas Waits (as transcribed) as Fox were to be the two stars, but Fox's actor feuded with Walter Hill, who killed the character off midway, rewrote the last 45 minutes, and used a crew member with the same hair as a stunt double, seen from behind with Mercy before a cop throws him into the train; nobody later asks what happened to Fox the way they ask about Ajax.
The actor told the story at a 2015 reunion where the cast rode the subway to Coney; another host disliked his face in the zoom-in and was glad he died.
The death should have established the stakes of the all-night journey and made the arrival a relief, but it is so quick and so hamstrung together that it has no emotional payoff.
Today a studio would recast as with Eric Stoltz and Michael J. Fox in Back to the Future rather than concoct a stunt death; it also creates a hole when Swan returns to an empty station with no ambulances or police after a man was thrown in front of a train.
Why the Warriors run from police is debated: they are a gang in colors where they should not be, and the fire, the assassination and the DJ keep police on alert; starting the fire five stops down is called a smart move by the other gangs, and Masai is said to have been pulling the strings like Masai Uhiri (as transcribed).
Cleon; the Warriors' vests; Central Park in seventies movies; Luther; Barry DeVorzen's soundtrack; the gang DJ; the seventies prom couple scene; 'You guys are real good. The best'; the world building; Cyrus
Cleon, the original warlord who is killed after the Rogue in the leopard-print headpiece blames the Warriors, has more scenes in the uncut version; he dies under a pile of elbows from 25 guys, flicks Luther off him with an amazing move, and a Cleon prequel about the rise of the Warriors is wished for; the jackets and shirtless vests also hold up.
A vest with no shirt is never a win unless you are a professional wrestler. — Sean Fennessey
Others disagree about the vest, one joking about wearing a leather vest with sunscreen and phone pockets to the beach before admitting it is not serious; the vest is the part connected to most because of the Orphans scene, where Mercy goads the Orphans into demanding the Warriors remove their colors, which recalls the cuts in Sons of Anarchy that you die before taking off.
Central Park in seventies movies is creepy, empty and dangerous; Luther, the leader of the Rogues, is an over-the-top villain going for it, loved for having no reason for anything he does beyond 'because we can', and one host's son loves how over the top he is.
Whether villains need motivation splits the room: one says explaining a villain is a waste of time, citing the Joker, and two disagree and need a reason; Luther was one of only two actors one host recognized, from Commando, with Remar recognized as Raiden from Mortal Kombat 2.
The actor who plays Luther was purposefully recast by Walter Hill as Luther in 48 Hours, turning on Eddie Murphy's crew, and has been on Twin Peaks and in Spike Lee movies; Walter Hill hit a zone with this film and 48 Hours in how an action movie moves with music.
Barry DeVorzen's weird-guitar soundtrack has aged well, but ending on a big Joe Walsh song creates cognitive dissonance after a black gang beats the Rogues; in the movie's defense there is no hip hop yet in 1979, though Sugarhill Gang existed, and a hard funk record or Across 110th Street would make more sense.
The Orphans scene is too long but the one Orphan asleep who missed the meeting is pitied; the gang DJ is a great device for spreading information in coded language before texting and Twitter.
The seventies prom couple scene is weirdly effective because the film is about guys with no hope fighting all night to get back to the Wonder Wheel, the action-movie version of the end of The Graduate, with the couple looking at Mercy's dirty feet and Swan stopping her from fixing her hair.
'You guys are real good, the best' is a precursor to intentionally hokey, iconic moments like Carl Weathers and Schwarzenegger in Predator; the stilted dialogue is a purposeful comic-book, stentorian, Greek-tragedy theatricality, and nobody talks the way people actually talk. — Sean Fennessey
The world building has aged best for another host: an elaborate gang network with rules and systems that later films such as John Wick's assassin network build on, which is undeniably cool even for a viewer who does not get the Greek-tragedy part.
Cyrus has aged best: a charismatic figure offering hope whose plan makes no sense if you listen carefully, likened to how Trump got elected and to Obama's 2008 'yes we can', and his death four and a half minutes after meeting him is devastating. — Bill Simmons
