Apex Mountain is called too tough to say for Coogler and Jordan. — Bill Simmons
With the Black Panther performance polarizing, there is a chance Creed could be Jordan's Apex Mountain; who knows.
Jordan's path: Wallace on The Wire as a vision of lost innocence, Vince Howard on Friday Night Lights, a Parenthood stretch and a nothing part in Chronicle. — Sean Fennessey
Fruitvale made him a star, then Fantastic Four as Johnny Storm and That Awkward Moment raised worries it was over.
Denzel's first ten years had shaky choices too (Carbon Copy, Virtuosity), but those mistakes were interesting while Jordan's are conventional because they are the only options now. — Wesley Morris
Next to more seasoned actors, including his Black Panther co-star, Stallone and Rashad, some layers are missing; Jordan is hungry and intense, compared to Angela Bassett at 10 all the time. — Wesley Morris
A joke says he needs a Man on Fire-style detective role.
His Killmonger is a maximum-intensity read of a radical character among classically trained co-stars; the hope is he works with other directors and then returns to Coogler. — Wesley Morris
The pairing is compared to Scorsese and De Niro; one panelist says that is unfair to Jordan because De Niro was positioned by filmmakers; Coogler communicates differently from media-trained people, 'so bay.'
Midnight Run is named a favorite De Niro performance, with a debate over favorite versus best.
Stallone requested that Jordan wear the flag trunks from Rocky 1, 3 and 4. — Bill Simmons
Jordan really got clocked in the 11th round after Stallone challenged him to take one; the story from a 2015 podcast is promised at the end. — Bill Simmons
The knockdown and fantasy revival montage is compared to the heart-shaped herb sequence in Black Panther. — Wesley Morris
Adrian's restaurant scenes were filmed at the Victor Cafe in Philadelphia. — Wesley Morris
Jordan gained 24 pounds of muscle, working out two to three times a day six days a week, and looks even bigger in Black Panther.
Adrian's maiden name (heard as Pernino), said by the priest at Rocky and Adrian's wedding, was a favorite trivia test; Paulie is called a terrible brother with reprehensible behavior in Rocky. — Bill Simmons
The Andre Ward cameo, when Adonis climbs in the ring to take on the whole gym and Ward knocks him out, is offered first. — Bill Simmons
Three great scenes are named: the two-round fight with Leo filmed in one shot, the seven-minute cancer-revival training sequence ending with the ATVs outside Rocky's house, and the 11th and 12th rounds of the final fight. — Bill Simmons
The one-shot fight is called an all-time how-did-they-do-this scene, with the camera cutting to Jordan and Stallone and whirling back around. — Bill Simmons
The cinematographer Alberti, who also shot The Wrestler, is praised, and Creed is called a much better-shot movie than The Wrestler. — Wesley Morris
The ATV training sequence is a genuine stand-up-in-your-seat moment, an urban 2015 version of the Rocky run 40 years later. — Bill Simmons
The final fight's 11th and 12th rounds, with the towel nearly thrown and the line about proving he is not a mistake, are called a great, stressful five minutes. — Bill Simmons
The two-round one-shot match is called the best boxing scene ever seen and gets a vote. — Bill Simmons
A second vote for the one-shot fight: beyond technical mastery it tells a story, as the trainer's tip in the ring leads to the knockout a minute later, building their bond, followed by the 'you didn't tell me you had hands like that' moment. — Sean Fennessey
Bianca's hands line prompts a joke about what it implies about sleeping with him.
Asked about the ATV scene, a panelist loves it and adds the warm-up before the last fight, rocking back and forth while being talked into it, and receiving the gloves and trunks.
Bianca's Philly slang 'John' (jawn) would have worked better with the accent; one panelist saw the movie in Philadelphia with a sleepy crowd. — Wesley Morris
Another answer agrees on the one-shot fight and adds the scene where the vomiting in the ring reveals Rocky's illness, a painterly, Renaissance-lit presentation, later tied to Adonis saying he will fight if Rocky fights. — Wesley Morris
Many things are needlessly beautiful: the first kiss shot upside down and the booth framing on their first date.
Rashad's performance in the first scene, with its spacing and sense of history, gave complete confidence in the movie.
The juvenile detention tracking shot, the long deep-focus shot with the supervisor watching in the background, and Leo's dad eyeing Rocky at the gym are cited as touches of a good filmmaker. — Wesley Morris
Another pick is the two-round match while also riding with the ATV scene, which gains context from the Eagles' Super Bowl and the Meek Mill song; kids who find Rocky slow like Creed. — Bill Simmons
The ATV scene honors Bill Conti's score, going slow motion and quiet mid-song, and the theme hits as the final round begins. — Bill Simmons
A late addition: the jail scene where an angry Adonis tells Rocky off and Stallone slow-plays it is called really good acting. — Bill Simmons
In the late seventies the film almost happened with Clint Eastwood and Richard Pryor until Eastwood did Escape from Alcatraz instead; that version would surely be far less racist and would become a Richard Pryor movie in the Brewster's Millions or Stir Crazy mold, probably sillier, and Pryor was coming apart on sets then, setting himself on fire in what the hosts date as 1982.
Jeff Bridges turned down Jack Cates because he did not want another cop movie; nobody could be better than Nolte, though a method Bridges putting on twenty pounds and going dark might have been pretty good, and Nolte is still permanently Jack Cates in a way an Ed Harris version would not have been.
Gregory Hines was the first choice for Reggie and dropped out to do Cotton Club, prompting a Running Scared tangent: a total 48 Hours ripoff in which Hines is really funny, and whose Florida Keys stretch with Michael McDonald is the movie one host wanted the whole time; Hines would have been pretty good, obviously not Eddie Murphy good.
Sly Stallone and Burt Reynolds allegedly both turned down Jack Cates, the kind of claim attached to every movie of the era; Reynolds could have taken the part to a bad place and might have ruined the movie, though Longest Yard-era Reynolds was good in tight roles like this.
Earlier, the studio nearly fired Eddie three or four days into the shoot because they did not think he was funny enough, with Michael Eisner running Paramount; called a good what-if that would have been a bad decision.
