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Nightclub scene into the sex scene

Bill Simmons: The opening murder is ruled out as a most rewatchable scene because a man gets brutally stabbed to death.

Bill Simmons: The first visit to Catherine's house is nominated: the cliffside drive and the house itself, which a half-assed internet research lookup suggested was listed for $52 million, though that is flagged as possibly untrue.

The film

Basic Instinct (1992)

Directed by Paul Verhoeven · Thriller

Cast

Selected cast credits · Film reference

Michael Douglas Det. Nick Curran
Sharon Stone Catherine Tramell
Jeanne Tripplehorn Dr. Beth Garner
Denis Arndt Lieutenant Walker
Bruce A. Young Andrews
Chelcie Ross Captain Talcott
Wayne Knight John Correli
Daniel Von Bargen Lieutenant Nilsen
Stephen Tobolowsky Dr. Lamott
Benjamin Mouton Harrigan
Dorothy Malone Hazel Dobkins
Jack McGee sheriff
Bill Cable Johnny Boz
Stephen Rowe Internal Affairs investigator
Mitch Pileggi Internal Affairs investigator
Mary Pat Gleason Juvenile officer
Freda Foh Shen Berkeley registrar
James Rebhorn Dr. McElwaine
David Wells Polygraph examiner
Bradford English Campus policeman
Juanita Jennings Receptionist
Craig C. Lewis Bartender/Police bar
Peter Appel Detective
Michael Halton Bartender/Country western bar
Keith A. McDaniel Featured dancer
Eric Poppick Coroner's guy
Ron Cacas Policeman
Elsie Sniffen Roxy's friend
Lindy Rasmusson Doo wah rider
Byron Berline Doo wah rider
Eddie Dunbar Doo wah rider
Tod McKibbin Doo wah rider
Julie Bond Hand puppet model
Ken Liebenson Doo wah rider

Everything from the episode

In the order the hosts got to it. Open a row for the discussion.

17:57

Half-Assed Internet Research

Director's cut differences; no body doubles; script rewrites; unrehearsed Douglas-Tripplehorn scene; Eszterhas's real...

Director's cut differences; no body doubles; script rewrites; unrehearsed Douglas-Tripplehorn scene; Eszterhas's real-life inspirations; ten-day script

In the discussion (10)
Approx. transcript time · 00:17:57Read transcript
  • Director's cuts generally seem a rip-off, adding a few seconds of shots rather than crazy material. — Bill Simmons
  • The director's cut differs in three scenes: a more violent opening murder, a longer Nick-Beth rape scene, and different angles in the main sex scene including the oral sex. — Mallory Rubin
  • The main sex scene was reportedly filmed for five days of 10-hour shoots because Douglas feared edits; Verhoeven choreographed every movement with storyboards.
  • Per the research, no body doubles were used in any of the sex scenes. — Bill Simmons
  • Per the research, Verhoeven had a lesbian sex scene rewritten after the screenwriter called it exploitative; four rewrites followed before he was brought back. — Bill Simmons
  • The Douglas-Tripplehorn sex scene was reportedly filmed while the performers thought they were rehearsing and kept in the final cut; the far-back camera is noted. — Bill Simmons
  • The screenwriter said he based Catherine on a go-go dancer in Ohio who pulled a .22 on him in a hotel room. — Bill Simmons
  • The screenwriter wrote in his book Hollywood Animal that he had a one-nighter with Sharon Stone after release; the recounting is called ungentlemanly. — Bill Simmons
  • He also said Nick was based on a cop he knew from his newspaper days. — Mallory Rubin
  • The script was apparently written in 10 days with no outline. — Bill Simmons
37:17

Roger Ebert's review

In the discussion (7)
Approx. transcript time · 00:37:17Read transcript
  • Per the hosts, Ebert was not a fan and gave the film two out of four stars. — Bill Simmons
  • Ebert is quoted as saying the film was well crafted but died in the last half hour, like a crossword puzzle that keeps your interest until you solve it and is then a worthless scrap with the spaces filled in. — Mallory Rubin
  • The critique is called fair: the two halves of the movie do not match, and once you figure out the outcome the plot momentum fizzles. — Mallory Rubin
  • None of the characters are likable, which is part of what makes the film interesting; Douglas is said to have felt Nick did not deserve to be saved. — Mallory Rubin
  • In Ebert's defense, the detective casework is ludicrous and easy to figure out, though the movie is still fun to laugh through for two hours and eight minutes. — Mallory Rubin
  • The film is really a vibe movie: the Jerry Goldsmith score, early-90s San Francisco and Carmel; you know who the murderer is in the first three minutes. — Bill Simmons
  • It is surprising that Ebert was upset the mystery fell apart, though viewers expecting a puzzle box could be let down. — Mallory Rubin
41:56

Most Rewatchable Scene

Nightclub scene into the sex scene

Nightclub scene into the sex scene

In the discussion (26)
Approx. transcript time · 00:41:56Read transcript
  • The opening murder is ruled out as a most rewatchable scene because a man gets brutally stabbed to death. — Bill Simmons
  • The first visit to Catherine's house is nominated: the cliffside drive and the house itself, which a half-assed internet research lookup suggested was listed for $52 million, though that is flagged as possibly untrue. — Bill Simmons
  • The first interview has exchanges like "Are you a pro?" "I'm an amateur" and "Are you sorry he's dead?" "Yeah, I liked fucking him," and is called one of the best character introductions ever.
  • The setting is symbolic: beautiful and serene on top, choppy water and jagged rocks over the edge. — Mallory Rubin
  • Her lines scandalize the detectives, men in their 40s; in 1992 there were no characters like this who were in complete control. — Bill Simmons
  • The second house visit is nominated too: she changes in front of them, the cigarette exchange in the car, and the new book about a detective who falls for the wrong woman. — Bill Simmons
  • The police interrogation, featuring Newman from Seinfeld and Eddie Harris from Major League, with the cocaine question, the crotch shot and the lie detector, is called the most rewatchable eight to nine minutes of the movie. — Bill Simmons
  • More lines are added from the interrogation; the cuts are brilliant, she is in command though nominally in their power, and the scene would have been a meme machine in the GIF era. — Mallory Rubin
  • The leg-cross is called one of the great movie star scenes of the last 30 years; Kathleen Turner and Faye Dunaway are floated as comparisons, but doubted as able to command the room the same way. — Mallory Rubin
  • The hosts say the leg-cross was Verhoeven's idea in the room and not in the script; Stone claimed she did not know the shot would be used, while he said they had discussed it; they say it would be a huge deal in 2020. — Bill Simmons
  • The hosts relay the story that Verhoeven told her the underwear was reflecting the lights, and debate whether the character wore underwear given the earlier dressing scene. — Mallory Rubin
  • Stone is praised for speaking openly about the lack of permission and its impact on her career, while the moment is still held up as iconic. — Mallory Rubin
  • The shot is called invasive because of the interrogation power dynamic, even though she is fully naked later in the film. — Chris Ryan
  • Catherine stopping by Nick's place, taking the ice pick and his cigarette, and calling him Shooter is liked, as is the pre-cell-phone habit of waiting on a stoop.
  • The nightclub: Nick is the oldest guy by 18 years in the V-neck, the three-person cocaine stall scene is called the all-time best, and Roxy's dancing is praised. — Bill Simmons
  • The hosts say the sex scene took five days to shoot; first-time viewers wonder whether he will be murdered, and Michael Douglas's butt is the funniest part. — Bill Simmons
  • The hosts say Verhoeven wanted full frontal nudity from Douglas, whose contract prohibited it. — Mallory Rubin
  • A director's cut viewing claims a side-angle glimpse and dwells on the strained eye contact during oral sex, which is called hilarious. — Mallory Rubin
  • Verhoeven is paraphrased as saying men think they know how women have sex but do not know how other men have sex. — Mallory Rubin
  • The ceiling mirror, fingers in mouths, the white scarf and the back scratch with no blood on white sheets are called ludicrous and mesmerizing. — Mallory Rubin
  • Nick visiting Catherine the next day ("a pretty good beginning," "I'm in love with you already, but I'll nail you anyway") is nominated as a great Basic Instinct scene. — Bill Simmons
  • A production flaw is noted: there is no sand beach at her property, so the hosts guess the beach part was filmed elsewhere; no later scene is seen as rewatchable once the whodunit kicks in.
  • Other nominations: the homicidal-impulse conversation that reveals how much Catherine knows about Nick, the Gus and Beth murder sequence and case wrap-up as near comedy, and the suspenseful final scene. — Mallory Rubin
  • The pick is the nightclub scene by far, lumped with the sex scene, including the dancing and Roxy getting mad. — Chris Ryan
  • Another pick is the car ride through the police interrogation, for the Bay Area and her command of the room.
  • A third participant calls the interrogation legendary but sides with Chris on the sex scene, with the club scene as the cherry on top. — Mallory Rubin
1:07:05

What’s Aged the Best?

Cigarette smoking; Roxy; corny cop banter; pre-tech-boom San Francisco; Sharon Stone's performance

Cigarette smoking; Roxy; corny cop banter; pre-tech-boom San Francisco; Sharon Stone's performance

In the discussion (9)
Approx. transcript time · 01:07:05Read transcript
  • One of the greatest cigarette-smoking movies ever; per the hosts, Eszterhas later regretted making cigarettes attractive after throat cancer, but smoking symbolizes Nick unraveling.
  • The opening scene is called one of the best-written openings, often ripped off.
  • Roxy is lights out, and it is unclear why she did not become a big star; Newman is also mentioned.
  • Nick calling her Rocky instead of Roxy is liked, whether a Douglas mistake or an insult. — Bill Simmons
  • The post-sex window-bench scene ("Somebody has to die") is liked.
  • The corny cop banter is shouted out, especially "Stop riding me, man! I'll kick your fucking teeth in!" at the bar.
  • Pre-tech-boom 1992 San Francisco, with Carmel and Marin, aged the best. — Mallory Rubin
  • Sharon Stone's performance is called the obvious answer, alongside ceiling sex mirrors, Picasso nods, the Bart Simpson keyring and Catherine's timeless fashion. — Mallory Rubin
  • A final vote goes to the cigarette smoking and Sharon Stone. — Mallory Rubin
1:09:17

Probably Unanswerable Questions

Semen at Boz's crime scene; erection after death; Gus's survival in thrillers; slowest elevator; Manny Vasquez's kill...

Semen at Boz's crime scene; erection after death; Gus's survival in thrillers; slowest elevator; Manny Vasquez's killer; Jeanne Tripplehorn's career; how long Nick and Catherine lasted; Nick not reading her ending; Nick's calluses; silent traffic in the chase; Nick as a tail; unseen headlines; Catherine and Nick's wife; purpose of the Beth scene; ending with Nick's death; Catherine's writing speed

In the discussion (14)
Approx. transcript time · 01:09:17Read transcript
  • The amount of semen at Boz's crime scene is questioned, since the house has a maid.
  • Why would a man die mid-orgasm and not remain erect? The answer offered is that other parts stiffen, not that.
  • The black light CSI moment is saved for aged-worst discussion. — Mallory Rubin
  • Has anyone named Gus ever survived a thriller? No. — Bill Simmons
  • The elevator is the slowest ever, given the time Nick needs to run up the stairs. — Mallory Rubin
  • Who killed Manny Vasquez the boxer, said to be a guy with an Afro?
  • Why did Jeanne Tripplehorn not fully happen? She never transcended the wife-girlfriend role, and Laura Linney got those parts. — Bill Simmons
  • How long did Nick and Catherine last? Guesses range from three days to three weeks, and Basic Instinct 2 is not acknowledged.
  • Why does Nick never ask to see the last pages of her book? — Mallory Rubin
  • Other questions: Nick's hand calluses, silent traffic in the car chase, Nick as the worst tail, and headlines the movie never showed. — Mallory Rubin
  • Could Catherine have been involved in Nick's wife's death, or did she just use it? The answer is no. — Mallory Rubin
  • Why include the ambiguous rape scene when Nick's dark side was already established? — Bill Simmons
  • Is the movie better if she kills him at the last second? That would be awesome, but the ambiguous ending is also liked.
  • How quickly does Catherine write, on the Joe Eszterhas schedule? — Mallory Rubin
1:16:03

What’s Aged the Worst?

No DNA; Beth's ID photos; Gus murder sequence and case wrap-up; Hazel Dobkins subplot; LGBT depictions; no condoms; N...

No DNA; Beth's ID photos; Gus murder sequence and case wrap-up; Hazel Dobkins subplot; LGBT depictions; no condoms; Nick's fashion; SFPD depiction

In the discussion (9)
Approx. transcript time · 01:16:03Read transcript
  • The case would be solved in five minutes with DNA technology; per the hosts, Eszterhas later admitted omitting DNA was a mistake, though he wrote it in the 80s. — Bill Simmons
  • The ID photos linking Elizabeth Garner to Lisa Hoberman are her current photo and one with a blonde wig, which is called bad for a $50 million movie. — Bill Simmons
  • The Gus murder sequence and the wrap-up with the blonde wig and clippings is a bad six minutes that ends abruptly, though forgiven. — Bill Simmons
  • It is wondered whether the filmmakers were unsure of the third act, given rewrites and Eszterhas's return. — Chris Ryan
  • The Hazel Dobkins subplot is a nonsensical red herring that does not pay off. — Bill Simmons
  • The sexual assault on Beth does not play well, though it is noted it was already considered bad in 1992.
  • The LGBT depictions: the hosts say the film was protested by gay rights activists during production, and the suspected or actual killers are gay or bisexual characters. — Mallory Rubin
  • Despite the AIDS-era motivation mentioned earlier, the sex scenes involve no condoms, and it is played as a joke. — Mallory Rubin
  • Nick's fashion and the SFPD's depiction also age poorly: the raincoat-size evidence, possibly planted evidence, Beth left on Nick's case, and Nick's four shootings in five years. — Mallory Rubin
1:21:48

Casting What-Ifs

Kim Basinger and other stars for Catherine; Tom Berenger and other leading men for Nick; Milos Forman as director

Kim Basinger and other stars for Catherine; Tom Berenger and other leading men for Nick; Milos Forman as director

In the discussion (6)
Approx. transcript time · 01:21:48Read transcript
1:23:54

The Joey Pants “That Guy” Award

Daniel von Bargen as Marty Nilsen

Daniel von Bargen as Marty Nilsen

In the discussion (5)
Approx. transcript time · 01:23:54Read transcript
  • George Dzundza is raised as a that guy, from The Deer Hunter and Law & Order. — Bill Simmons
  • The actor known as Eddie Harris from Major League, the Hoosiers bad guy and Hard Bob from Billions, is called an iconic that guy and agreed to be amazing, with uncertainty over his name. — Bill Simmons
  • The guy Nick feuds with who gets shot in the head is probably the winner; he is identified as Daniel von Bargen as Marty Nilsen.
  • Nilsen has some of the best lines, notably "You fucked yourself, Shooter, you hear me? You are out," and the idea of an internal affairs guy tailing Nick is loved. — Chris Ryan
  • Dr. Lamott (Stephen Tobolowsky), beginning every declaration with "You're dealing with," is proposed.
1:25:28

The Ruffalo / Hanna / Rubinek / Partridge Overacting Award

Michael Douglas; Gus

Michael Douglas; Gus

In the discussion (3)
Approx. transcript time · 01:25:28Read transcript
  • Nilsen is acknowledged, but the pick is Michael Douglas for "Stop riding me, man" and "Who has access to my goddamn file?"
  • Douglas goes Brick Tamland a bunch, his most overacting outside one other role; the hosts joke that fellow cops accept his cocaine use because he worked undercover.
  • Another pick is Gus for all the yelling and every "Hoss." — Mallory Rubin
1:26:38

Recasting Couch

No affirmative selection

No affirmative selection

In the discussion (3)
Approx. transcript time · 01:26:38Read transcript
  • Leading into the couch, asked whether Don Johnson or Michael Douglas would be better in the role, the answer is Douglas, though Don Johnson's smoking would have been great.
  • Nothing needs changing; the movie is perfect from a well-done or unintentional-comedy standpoint. — Bill Simmons
  • Whether the movie is better or worse with Pacino is asked; Pacino in sexual situations is called uncomfortable, and one of his earlier roles is essentially the same guy. — Bill Simmons
1:26:54

The Dion Waiters Award for Best Heat Check Performance

Roxy

Roxy

In the discussion (2)
Approx. transcript time · 01:26:54Read transcript
  • Roxy is the pick, with lines like "If you don't leave her alone, I'll kill you," and the award could be renamed for her.
  • It is unclear why she did not become a massive star; she was captivating and could have gone after Shannon Tweed's corner. — Bill Simmons
1:31:01

Apex Mountain

Sharon Stone as Catherine Tramell; Roxy

Sharon Stone as Catherine Tramell; Roxy

In the discussion (6)
Approx. transcript time · 01:31:01Read transcript
  • Sharon Stone is the apexiest Apex Mountain performance; Catherine Tramell is at the top. — Bill Simmons
  • A joke asks whether the bad cunnilingus is Apex Mountain for being captured on film. — Bill Simmons
  • Pre-Silicon Valley San Francisco seems innocent, before real estate skyrocketed. — Bill Simmons
  • Roxy is offered as another Apex Mountain. — Mallory Rubin
  • The deep V-neck sweater is the inverse, Apex Valley, worn from the nightclub to the beach to work.
  • Whether it is Apex Mountain for rear scrotal hang shots is asked, with Will Smith in Wild Wild West as a comparison. — Mallory Rubin
1:33:27

Picking Nits

Cop pulling a gun in the office; Glock sniffed for a .38; no DNA testing; Hazel Dobkins timeline; Roxy timeline; Nick...

Cop pulling a gun in the office; Glock sniffed for a .38; no DNA testing; Hazel Dobkins timeline; Roxy timeline; Nick's lame convertible; uncracked Lotus windshield; bloodless Roxy; aggressive cop bars

In the discussion (7)
Approx. transcript time · 01:33:27Read transcript
  • A cop pulls a gun to end a shoving match in the department.
  • After Nilsen's death, they sniff Nick's gun, clearly a Glock, although they said it was a .38 revolver; DNA testing is again cited. — Mallory Rubin
  • Hazel Dobkins killed her husband and three kids in 1956 and was released in 1965, and Gus would have been a toddler at the time. — Mallory Rubin
  • Roxy was arrested in 1986 at 16 for killing two siblings, served a couple of years, and is already with Catherine by 1992. — Mallory Rubin
  • Nick drives the lamest convertible of the early 90s; a Corvette is suggested; he also drives a Plymouth in the chase. — Mallory Rubin
  • Roxy hits Nick with the Lotus without cracking the windshield, and her corpse has no blood. — Mallory Rubin
  • Movie cop bars from 1988 to 1995 are all super aggressive, as in the De Niro cop movie. — Bill Simmons
1:37:38

The Neil McCauley “A Book about Metals” Award for Best Line from the Movie

"She got that magna cum laude pussy on her that done fried up your brain"; "Fuck like minks, raise rug rats and live ...

"She got that magna cum laude pussy on her that done fried up your brain"; "Fuck like minks, raise rug rats and live happily ever after"; "She's got a hundred million bucks"; "You know I don't wear any underwear, don't you, Nick?"; "Got a Pepsi in the fridge"; "Number one, I don't remember how often I used to jerk off, but it was a lot"

In the discussion (5)
Approx. transcript time · 01:37:38Read transcript
  • Each participant is limited to three quotes. — Bill Simmons
  • Gus's "magna cum laude" line is called the best quote, and another participant had it too.
  • Three more picks: "Fuck like minks, raise rug rats and live happily ever after"; "She's got a hundred million bucks" and what she does with it; and "You know I don't wear any underwear, don't you, Nick?" — Bill Simmons
  • The five-point answer is praised as rattled off without hesitation; "Did you really think it was so special?" is a quiet contender. — Mallory Rubin
  • Picks include the Pepsi line continuing the Coke jokes and Nick's five-point answer to the three psychiatrists. — Mallory Rubin
1:41:06

Sequel, Prequel, Limited Series, or All-Black Remake

Yes

Yes

In the discussion (2)
Approx. transcript time · 01:41:06Read transcript
  • Absolutely, and the casting would be fun.
  • It is proposed to tell it from Roxy's perspective, as a Rosencrantz-style retelling of the Basic Instinct universe.
1:51:16

Who Won the Movie?

Sharon Stone

Sharon Stone

In the discussion (1)
Approx. transcript time · 01:51:16Read transcript
Podcast choices

More from the conversation

A disclaimer calls this an NC-17 podcast not to be heard with kids around, followed by trailer audio.
Approx. transcript time · 00:02:21Read transcript
Chris Ryan and Mallory Rubin are introduced; the movie is called an all-time Apex Mountain Sharon Stone performance that launched a thousand Skinemax movies.
Approx. transcript time · 00:03:36Read transcript
First thoughts include a Hitchcock joke and Michael Douglas's butt, V-neck and dance scene.
Approx. transcript time · 00:03:52Read transcript
Sharon Stone's earlier career: Irreconcilable Differences, a Steven Seagal movie, Action Jackson and Total Recall, landing this role at 34.
Approx. transcript time · 00:06:02Read transcript
Stone lacked the Meg Ryan and Julia Roberts warmth then in vogue, both of whom are said to have turned the role down; she had an intensity since King Solomon's Mines.
Approx. transcript time · 00:07:12Read transcript
Stone peaked late; her New Pope cameo referenced the famous moment; she is said to have an IQ of 154.
Approx. transcript time · 00:08:10Read transcript
Per the hosts, Verhoeven was impressed by her in Total Recall, but Douglas did not want her and wanted another star to share the controversy.
Approx. transcript time · 00:09:23Read transcript
Kim Basinger would have fit best; Kathleen Turner and Greta Scacchi are also named; Stone is said to have modeled the role after Kathleen Turner.
Approx. transcript time · 00:09:46Read transcript
Diane Lane is floated after a host rewatched Unfaithful, called a borderline rewatchable; she could have played Beth but has too much sweetness for Catherine.
Approx. transcript time · 00:11:02Read transcript
The role requires someone for whom a man would throw his life away; Douglas's disbelieving laugh is noted; the first 45-50 minutes are better than the second half.
Approx. transcript time · 00:11:46Read transcript
Verhoeven's films are trashed on release and later rehabilitated; this was the ultimate sneak-in movie amid the controversy.
Approx. transcript time · 00:13:57Read transcript
Erotic thrillers worked as mainstream pornography; the hosts cite a Vanity Fair piece dating the Skinemax thriller to Night Eyes in 1990.
Approx. transcript time · 00:15:26Read transcript
A college senior at Holy Cross, one host saw it alone in a theater of solo men; the leg-cross is compared to seeing the shark in Jaws.
Approx. transcript time · 00:16:37Read transcript
Douglas's 1984-2000 run is listed; Nick is a dark cocaine-using character unlike Fatal Attraction's everyman; he always wears a suit and trench coat.
Approx. transcript time · 00:21:09Read transcript
Asked why nobody names Douglas as a favorite actor: he became a movie star in his early 40s, embodied the late-80s male psyche and never had a Harrison Ford action career.
Approx. transcript time · 00:23:25Read transcript
Douglas never factored personally for one host, whose mom's favorites were Harrison Ford and Douglas; many roles are repellent by design.
Approx. transcript time · 00:25:20Read transcript
Douglas is as likely to get an Oscar as a Razzie nomination; his career is compared with Karl Malone's.
Approx. transcript time · 00:26:44Read transcript
His producing credits, backing of Verhoeven and luck with co-stars and directors are praised; he chose risky, zeitgeist material.
Approx. transcript time · 00:28:23Read transcript
Douglas unapologetically called the film smut; the hosts say he wanted to keep sex in movies amid AIDS fears.
Approx. transcript time · 00:30:45Read transcript
The hosts say Carolco bought Eszterhas's script for $3 million and the film made $352 million worldwide, fourth in 1992.
Approx. transcript time · 00:33:27Read transcript
Before the internet, such movies drew audiences; the erotic thriller is dead, with Monster's Ball and Gone Girl as later comparisons.
Approx. transcript time · 00:33:49Read transcript
The black-light stain scene would still shock on a Netflix show; Mrs. Fletcher is cited; 9 1/2 Weeks, Angel Heart and Fatal Attraction came before.
Approx. transcript time · 00:35:57Read transcript
A mid-episode break promotes The Wire: Way Down in the Hole and Flying Coach.
Approx. transcript time · 00:41:05Read transcript
The Johnny Boz casting requirements are joked about.
Approx. transcript time · 01:08:13Read transcript
A question asks how to get Chris Ryan smoking again and calling him Shooter, if the pandemic ever ends.
Approx. transcript time · 01:30:36Read transcript
A would-you-rather: Nick's V-neck after day three or Johnny Boz's sheets.
Approx. transcript time · 01:33:01Read transcript
Mallory's callus question prompts the joke that she just won the movie.
Approx. transcript time · 01:46:05Read transcript
The close calls it the pod of the century, thanks Chris Ryan and Mallory Rubin, and repeats the World Central Kitchen and podcast plugs.
Approx. transcript time · 01:51:28Read transcript